The State of Our Union [And the fight to keep it]
A marriage podcast designed to encourage reconnection, through open dialogue about the topics that challenges most marriages.
The State of Our Union [And the fight to keep it]
How This Ambitious Wife Learned She Didn’t Have to Choose | Kathy Huynh Cabico
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
What happens when a woman refuses to choose between being a devoted wife and becoming fully herself? Kathy Huynh Cabico shares the mindset shift that helped her as an ambitious woman, to stop shrinking inside her marriage and start showing up with confidence and power. Kathy is a wife, mom, beauty entrepreneur, and wealth and expansion coach who built her hair and makeup company in Orange County while balancing corporate work, motherhood, and marriage. Kathy shares why changing herself first led to the changes she experienced in her relationship. Kathy also opens up about burnout, what she learned about asking for help, and how she stopped projecting her inner stress onto her husband. If you are married and juggling motherhood and entrepreneurship you do not want to miss this episode.
If you would like to learn more about wealth energetics, identity & embodiment (the inner work) I have my Free Telegram channel called The Wealth Recalibration Codes that they can tune into!
www.kathyhuynh.com/wrc
Connect with Kathy:
IG: @kathyhuynhcabico
--
Thanks for tuning in! If today’s EP resonated with you, subscribe, like, and share it with someone who needs it. Connect with me on all platforms @karenwillcoach - and if you are ready to go deeper, join the community and continue the conversation inside my Facebook group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/loveandconflict" Until next time, let’s continue to fight for our union.
Hello, and once again, this is the State of Our Union and the Fight to Keep It. I am so excited to have you here on another episode. I am Karen Williams, your host, and today I am excited. I have a super exciting guest. Her name is Kathy Kapico, and she's gonna tell you a little bit about herself. But before she before I introduce you to Kathy, I would just want to remind you that if you are here for the first time, I want you to catch up on all of the older, the older episode, you know, up to this point. You know, for those of you that are here for, you know, never heard of me, never seen the, you know, never listened, never seen the videos. Um, Rob and I have been married at 34 years this year, and I actually run a relationship coaching practice here in Las Vegas. I am local Las Vegas. Now, most of my guests, they come all the way from around the world and around the country. Kathy is joining me today from California, and again, I'm gonna allow her to tell you a little bit about herself. Welcome, Kathy.
SPEAKER_04Thank you so much, Karen, for having me here. I'm super excited. Um, my name is Kathy Juen Kabiko, and I am a mom, a wife. Um, I have a little five-year-old, so she's starting Kinder this year. Um I'm also a yeah, I'm also a business owner. I I owned a hair and makeup um company here in Orange County, uh, Kathy Juen Artistry. I'm also a wealth and expansion coach for ambitious women who are looking to be more confident, more wealthy, and more powerful. Um, so that's what I do, and I stay busy here in sunny California, which is I'm I'm super blessed. We pay the weather tax, but I wouldn't change that.
SPEAKER_05Oh my gosh. Speaking of weather, we're in Las Vegas at you know, 100 plus. So if you if we enjoy the day, uh we have up till eight o'clock.
SPEAKER_04Oh my gosh. Yes.
SPEAKER_05The rest is like, no. Yeah. But of course, you know, it's Vegas. We stay out, we stay inside during the um during the summer. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. I cannot imagine.
SPEAKER_05And you know, and we were talking earlier about when am I coming back to OC. Don't have an eight on my calendar yet, but it uh yeah. It will be sooner than later. Maybe sooner.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, it's in the it's in the good eight high eighties right now, you know, but I I think that's that's a big shift for you if you're coming from Vegas, right? Oh yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_0580 degrees would be oh, that would be perfection right now. Yes. All right, guys. So we're gonna jump into our conversation this morning. Um, Kathy, of course, we we did our you know, our pre-show questions, and you know, one of the things that um you know that popped out for me as I was going through your your uh questionnaire, um, you said one of the important things for you is the ability to express who you are without shame and guilt. And so I know a lot of us as um not just as wives, but as women, we sometimes carry that um, I don't know what you call it, a stigma maybe. You know, we walk into the rooms and we automatically feel like we're less than. We start comparing ourselves, you know, to other people that's in the room, whether it's other women or, you know, just other people in general. And so we take that same um, we take that same baggage into our marriage. Tell me a little bit about that. What did that look like for you if you experienced that? And what would you, you know, how would you guide somebody out of that?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, you know, I've always been pretty ambitious, I would say, all of my life. And, you know, very driven, self-motivated. Um, and I'm very like independent, if you will. You know, I want to be financially independent, I want to have my own career, I want to have my own thing. Um, but what I found that, you know, once you are in a marriage, that sort of like changes in a way where maybe like I don't like it, you know, uh, because when you're in a marriage, it's almost like you said, there's this stigma of like who you need to be and what role you need to play in that relationship. And especially when you start to have kids, you're these there's certain expectations that are being put on you. And it's all I feel like it's all societal expectations, and so your spouse who you know grew up watching, you know, especially my husband, he grew up watching his mom, who is very domesticated, like she, you know, cooked, cleaned, took care of the kids, and she was working, you know. And so I think for my husband, subconsciously, that was what he was kind of also expecting in a marriage as well, too. And so I find that through our relationship, it was kind of like a struggle, right? Right, like it almost feels like, okay, in order for me to be a good wife, it's almost like I had to choose between who I want to be, like the person that I know has this high potential, this driven person, or do I choose to be a good wife? You know, and if I choose to be a good wife, does that mean that I have to give up some of my ambition and be in the kitchen more? Yeah. So that so that was kind of like that mental struggle for me and and for a long time because I, you know, I was struggling to find that balance because, you know, I also come from a family where my mom was super domesticated too. Like she practically raised all of her kids, even though you know my dad was there, but it was during the wartime, so he was imprisoned, and um, so she took care of like all five kids single-handedly, and you know, very capable. She did everything. And so I grew up watching that, and that was sort of like the expectation.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah. Wow, you you who we can probably hang out there for a second. I said a lot. Yeah, you can hang out there for a second. Um, so we're you uh again, because this podcast is really so targeted towards women who are in that first um, you know, three to four years of marriage and maybe feeling those same feelings, like, hey, okay, so the honeymoon is almost over now. This is like real life. Um, I came into this marriage, you know, my goal was to be the best wife ever. I don't think a lot of us have the conversation uh with our spouse enough to have, you know, when I say have, it's, you know, sometimes we we make a lot of assumptions. But actually talk through what a good wife would look like or a good spouse would look like to each of us. Honey, as a good husband, this is what my expectations are. As a good wife, this is what my expectations are. And I don't think we have that conversation often enough. Not realizing also that what also affects that dynamic is you also have gifts and callings on the inside of you. And they don't die when we become missus, whoever.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_05You know, totally. That's just a and in my opinion, um, missus is just is simply a title. Wifehood is a role. You still have a purpose on the inside of you, you still have an identity that have to be um defined, you know what I mean? And so, like you said, we can't um there has to be a way where as a uh ambitious woman, as a woman with gifts and talents and callings, that uh marriage isn't drowning any of those things out. Because I think part of that is um, you know, as wives, we we end up feeling somewhat frustrated that we aren't fulfilling those callings on our life. Now, now we are resenting marriage, and I don't think that's how that was designed to do that, because I think our gifts also bring a certain level um, you know, it our our marriage is actually weighed in on those gifts as well.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I agree, I agree, because I feel like if I don't fully express or pursue my ambitions or my dreams, I really wouldn't be fully myself. Like I in turn, I cannot add to the marriage, right? Because if I am constantly struggling and having this internal demon like fighting, um, I cannot fully be present in my marriage either. Exactly. You know, and I cannot give a part of myself when I my cup is not full, right? Because I'm not fulfilled, I'm not doing the things that I want to do, and I'm not happy with where I am. I cannot pour into my husband. So either way, it's uh to me, it's a loose-loose situation.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, it's a lose-lose situation. I I believe that. Um, and so a lot of um I think a lot of um a lot of young couples, they where do you think they're getting a lot of their idea or their ideas of what marriage should look like? Not what it should even be, but what it should look like. You know, where do you think they're getting a lot of that from?
SPEAKER_04Oh, I hundred percent think it's family, like their parents. Yeah. Their parents, you know, and is this idea and and and I think the and for me, what I'm observing is the dynamic is slowly shifting, like the landscape of it is slowly shifting because our generation, like my generation, um, you know, we are more uh working women, we're more ambitious. And so I think like, you know, for me especially, and the reason why I also decided that I'm not going to let my marriage define what's possible for me because I have a daughter, right? And I also want to be that example for her to also go out there, trace her dreams, but also she she can have both, you know, she can be a good wife and she can be ambitious. Um and so that was really is that turning point for me. And um, and I think that that it and overall, I think that landscape is also really changing because you know, more and more people in my generation, um, I think we're millennial, I think, yeah, uh yeah, millennial, like we're working and we're creating a new set of expectations, you know, because we've watched our parents like be a certain way and that's how we absorb those beliefs. But now I feel like we're changing it because we know that that's not realistic, you know. We know that that's not realistic. It's not like most of us are not at home, like stay-at-home wives. And so um that conversation is really changing. So I'm excited for it. Um, but yeah, but I truly believe that we pick that up from our parents, like from society.
SPEAKER_05Absolutely, absolutely. You're you're you're so right. And I I want to say um to the to the wife that's listening right now, if you choose to be, if if wifehood and raising your kids and taking care of your home is your ambition and that's your that's your thing. That's what you feel like you have been called to do, sis, we are here for you as well. You know, we're not feeling that you have to surrender that because hey, there's a lot of there's a lot of um cultures and you know, um, you know, family dynamic that were raised to say, hey, this is this is the extent of of my purpose. And that is so okay. You know, that is so okay. But I also want to make sure that, you know, the woman that is listening, that have that book on the inside of her, that have that real estate business on the inside of her, that, you know, I don't know, she has that invention that yes, there is space for her as well. You can still you can be a good wife and be um that inventor and that writer and that astronaut and you know, all of the things, you know. Yeah. I don't think your relationship completely define all of who you are. I think we are just more complex than that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, a hundred percent. Yeah, a hundred percent. And I think what's interesting too, you know, is just having um it's just making that decision. Yeah, that's that was that was key for me. Um, and again, you know, my husband's always been very supportive of what I chose, you know, like he just doesn't know what he doesn't know, right? Because he grew up watching his mom, the family dynamics. So that was his expectation. But I think the turning point for me was really making that decision that no, I can be an extraordinary entrepreneur, a very successful one, and also come home to my family and be a really good mom and a really good wife, like not having to choose between one or the other and being able to do both. Yeah, you know, and I think that there are seasons, right? Like if I'm in a season where I'm building my business, of course it I'm gonna not be as present, and that's okay. And then there are seasons where I'm not as busy at work because you know, with my work, it's very seasonal. So when the seasons where I'm not, um, you know, I I'm fully present. And yeah, people ask me all the time, like, how do you do it? Like, you know, running this business. And at the time too, when I was building my business, I was working in corporate and I was being a mom and a wife, you know. So everyone's like, Well, how do you do it all? And I'm just like, you know what? It's just a decision. It's like you don't have to be perfect in all those areas. The only thing that you can ask of yourself is you just show up and you do your best. Yes. Yes, you know, absolutely. And it's yeah, and for me, it's like, you know, I've worked like crazy hours, but I still show up to all the family functions. I still show up for all of my kids' events, I still show up and you know, for my husband, you know, I and and for me, it's like it's possible. It's possible. It's like you don't have to choose, like, oh, if I work and be an entrepreneur, I can't be with my family on the weekends. No, you can. I did it. You know, I worked on the weekends in the morning, and when I'm done with work, I'll go home, take a nap, and then show up for the family function. Yeah. You know, so it's it's almost like it's like you have to, for me, it's it's really comes down to you have to internally decide. Yes, that's gonna, that's gonna be what works for you. And and not let what society, what your mom, what your dad thinks about it. You know?
SPEAKER_05Yes. Absolutely, absolutely. Because I believe that when you when you get married, one of my guests um recently said this. Uh she and her and her husband had to come to the point where they have to realize they have to write the story for their own marriage. Yes. Um, we cannot copy it, you know, or what I say, incor we can, to a certain point, incorporate some of the amazing things that we learned growing up and the examples that we saw, and you know, incorporate those things. But this is a whole new dynamic, and we have to write our own story. But you said something about um seasons, and so because Rob and I have been married um as long as we have, um, this year will be our 34th anniversary. And so, isn't that amazing? Yeah, amazing. So you're talking about over three decades. So we have definitely gone through seasons, and I remember the seasons when um I was active duty military. Um, we were traveling a lot. I was, you know, there were times when I was gone. There was, you know, I didn't get to, I didn't get to say, okay, let me call in today. You know, it we didn't have that's not an option, right? Um so my active duty season, that was that was full time. That was all in, right? And then we realized that at some point, if we keep tracking the years, I wouldn't get to military retirement until my children were adults. And I said, okay, then I would have missed out on all of their childhood. We wouldn't have made any memories and those kind of things. So I made the decision at that point. Hey, stay-at-home mom season kicked right in, homeschool and kicked right in. And of course, I decided to go back to school. So, you know, I was in um you know, school of ministry. And uh, you know, it's it's like yeah, all of those things happen. But what I love about seasons, everything is not all happening all at once. Right, right. And so what I'm hearing you say also is that there is that um first that decision about what you're gonna do. And so we at that moment we start making uh provisions for the different seasons. What am I gonna need in this season? You know, no, I can't hang out with the girls too much in this season because the kids are this age. We have homework, we have bedtime, we have those different things. Of course, by the time they get to a certain age, and now of course the seasons change, you know. So now fast forward, we are grandparents. Now, this is like the laid-back season. So guess what? I'm pursuing all of the things that I didn't have the opportunity to pursue during that time. Now, I didn't, you know, I didn't have the what I say, the the the capacity or the landscape really didn't provide for it during that season. When I mean, could I have homeschooled and start a business? Probably could, you know, but we decided not to do that. We decided we're gonna focus on this area and then we just continue, continue on. But what I did not allow is for um, you know, for resentment or um, you know, all of those negative emotions to start driving my marriage because I couldn't do the things that I wanted to do. And I think that's where a lot of folks are getting really tripped up because now I'm mad at you because I'm not getting to do the things that I want to do. You know.
SPEAKER_04Right. Yeah, go ahead, Kathy. No, no, no, yeah. I was like, yeah, I mean, I remember, you know, before I left corporate, I was in a season of resentment and I just like had to catch myself.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um, you know, because I was working, I remember this is when my daughter was only like a year, like two. So childcare was a little tough too. And I was working full full-time job. We had just bought a home and we moved like, you know, 10 miles away from our family. So I had like my life in one city. We moved to a completely different city. I was working at my old spot. So my day was literally up at out of the house by eight with a little one in the back asleep, dropping her off at her grandparents, driving into work. It's like the whole ride was like 45 minutes, get to work. And I remember um picking her up at n like nighttime, driving her back home. And we wouldn't get home until like sometime 7:30, 8 o'clock. And then I had to still make dinner. Like I was making dinner at like 7:30, 8 o'clock, and we didn't eat until nine, you know, because we wanted to eat as a family, and so we didn't eat until nine. And I would just, by the time I was done, you know, washing up, doing the dishes, it was already time to get ready for bed. And everybody get in bed and then the next day wake up to do it all over again.
SPEAKER_00Do it all over again. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And I remember, um, and I did that for a little over a year, and that was a season was pretty hard for me because, you know, it's like my husband tried to help, and like, but like it wasn't, I just felt like there was so much weight on my shoulders, you know, and I was becoming so like resentful, not at him specifically, but just at the fact that I was feeling, yeah, it was just too much to carry. And and and I remember that some of the resentment kick in. I was like really irritable. Every little thing would like freak me out. And I found that it was because I didn't have enough time for myself. Like I didn't have enough like self-quiet time for myself. Like I didn't, I was just on the go all the time and I was just stimulated all the time. I didn't really have the time to like sit with myself, sit with my thoughts, like you know, try to process everything that was happening. So, yeah, so I I agree. Like that resentment like really was a rough patch for my marriage because I couldn't fully express, I couldn't fully express like what I was. Going through because I didn't even know what I was going through. I just knew that I was just cranky all the time, you know, because I was tired. Yeah, you know, and so my husband like, you know, would wanted to help, but he didn't know how to help because I couldn't verbalize like what was like irritating me. But yeah, but you know, looking back now is because I did not have like my own time. I didn't, I couldn't fully express my needs, you know. And sometimes I don't think women were really good at expressing our needs. Yeah. You know, and and I think that's what that I think that's for me, it's usually the case because I'm I'm learning every day how to communicate my needs better. But coming from, you know, I'm Asian, right? Like we don't we don't communicate well to start off with. We weren't taught to communicate well. So yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And so we we don't know how to ask for the things that we need in a relationship. And so for me, it was just like, okay, I'm just gonna take one on the chin and just you know toughen up and ride it out. But that didn't do either one of us any good because I wasn't I wasn't willing to ask for help or communicate or like have that open conversation. So yeah. So I think that was a big lesson for me as well, too.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. It the the hardest thing I know sometimes what really um, you know, work our husbands over is they they want to help, they don't know how to help because we don't know what we want to even ask them how to help. And then you have some of us who we we want to help, but we want to help a certain way. You know, if we like, okay, honey, I need can you do the dishes? I don't care how you do the dishes, I just want this shit done. You know, so we can't ask for help too and start dictating how the help should show up. You know, load it washer. Oh, well, you got it, you didn't load it right. Yeah. You know, you know, make dinner. Uh well, listen, make dinner is make dinner. I don't, you know, I I would rather it not be McDonald's chicken nuggets, but yeah, yeah. Whatever the design, whatever the meal is, you know, so sometimes the the help may not look like what we want it to, but it's still help. And then I know for us, for us women, sometimes again, we don't know what we need, so we don't know how to ask for what we want. And so that becomes part of the whole frustrating cycle because you said we get, you know, we're out the door by seven, eight o'clock, and you know, we're back at home 12 hours later, and we do it all over again, and it, you know, it becomes that vicious cycle. And I it was a season when I worked at the Pentagon and I used to um I used to commute. So I would get on the train, I would have to drop off the kids and be on that train no later than 7 a.m. Because I had to be at the pen my I had to be at my desk by 7 30.
SPEAKER_04Oh wow.
SPEAKER_05And those were, you know, again, those they they just the whole commuting process of it, you know, the you know, making sure that it because in the midst of all of that, you want your kids to eat healthy. You want them to still be actively playing and still learning and developing. And, you know, meanwhile, you know, because they in that season, my husband had gone back to school as well. And I'll never forget, Kathy. One evening I came home, and poor thing, he was so tired. He he sat down on the bed to tie his shoes, and he just laid back for a minute. Oh, and he was knocked out. So by the time I got home, he should have already been in class, you know.
SPEAKER_04Oh, yeah. Oh my gosh, yeah, yeah. It's like you gotta do what you gotta do in the season, right?
SPEAKER_05We're burning the candles at both ends. So I I get it, you know, that you know, and I share my story because and allow, you know, women like you to come on and share your story as well. Because, you know, I want to encourage listeners that you are not the only one going through this season. You know, we've all gone through it. The thing is, this podcast is designed to help you realize that, hey, you can get on the other side of it. There's life on the other side of it, there's such a joy on the other side of it. It really does build the character and resilience that you need that will carry you through um towards, you know, through life. Um what I want to ask also is during that um during that season, what will what did that reveal about you as a person? What did that what did what came up for you?
SPEAKER_04Oh, so much, Karen, so much. You know, so much. I mean, one thing was that I realized that I'm one, not as great of a communicator as I thought. And two, I had too much pride, like to ask for help or verbalize the help, or um, you know, or even try to, you know, because I'm like, oh, I got it, I got it, I got it. You know, like because in a way, like you have that pride that you don't want to feel like you failed in any role, you know. So if I ask for help, that means I can't take it on myself. And so you start to burden yourself, you know, um, by not releasing control.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um, but what it really um dictated, like what what it really showed up for me during that season is that it's like I'm self-projecting onto my husband a lot. Yeah, a lot. And that's usually what causes the rift, right? Because my husband just like, whoa, what did I just walk into? You know, and I'm over here ruminating about how corporal it is that he doesn't see that there's a dishes here and he's not helping and he's not doing this and he's not doing that, and it's all in my head. Right. And it's like, and it's like, um, and that's really what I had to learn that I need to get out of my head and like really back into my body and back into the reality. Because I think that we get to this point, right? We get to this point where we're just so burnt out, we're just so tired that we start to internally make up stories and beliefs about either our spouse or about the situation. Yeah. And it's like, it's like, it's like blown out of proportion, like in your head, and then all of a sudden he's the enemy.
unknownYou know?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, and all of a sudden he's like the enemy. And so, and then you're like going at him, and and that's usually what's what would start our, you know, fights, right? Or like conversations, because I would be so tired and I would like talk to him in a very rude, I guess, kind of way, is not loving, you know. And so he would take it like, what is happening? And and and it would rub him the wrong way because he has no context of what's been going on in my head for the last like two hours as I'm cleaning up, you know? And so, and so it's almost like it's like this invisible fight that he was never a part of, and I'm just like projecting on him, you know. And then of course, so he's gonna get like defensive, like I didn't do anything. Like, what are you talking about? And then it's like, yeah, you did, and you know, and it just it's just this like big blow up where it didn't need to happen, right? Where it didn't need to happen because um, because it was all just like role-played in my head. So for me, like through that season, and I'm still, you know, work in progress with this too, and just really learning is that sometimes you just need to kind of like learn how to regulate yourself, like in those moments, and just get out of your head, right? And you know, and it's just so interesting to me that you can easily like within a second split think of like 10 bad things that your spouse is not doing in that moment, but you've forgotten all the other 20 things that he did do, right?
SPEAKER_00Right, yeah.
SPEAKER_04And I think usually that's where the fights are, you know. And I'm just over here like, you didn't do this, this, this, this, this. And he was like, Yeah, but I did this, this, this, and this, you know. And and it's and this, yeah, exactly. And and you know, and just we are just so, you know, and this is what I learned doing the work that I do because I help women with the inner work, right? And it's always like you are always looking for evidence to back up the beliefs you already have. Shut your mouth, girl. Yes, yeah, yes, right. You because yeah, it's it's like I realized that I was literally just looking for evidence built to sort of to back up the belief I already had about him. Like, he's not helpful, you know, and and this is just me like ruminating in my head about and making up these stories and these beliefs, like, oh, he's not helpful. So immediately in my mind, I'm gonna look for five things that he did not do to be helpful for me. And then I'm going to run with it. Yeah. But you know, already. Yeah, yes, exactly. Here's the evidence, right? But yeah, and I used to think that no, he, you know, I'm I have this belief because he was unhelpful. But what I've really learned just as I become more emotionally intelligent, being being able to regulate myself more, is that no, it's actually I created that belief in my head first, and then I want to look for the evidence to back it up. Correct. You know, and so for me now it's like when I catch myself spiraling or like getting in my head about a certain belief about my husband, it's like I have to immediately stop that belief, get out of my head, and think of a new belief. Yeah. You know, like, oh, you know what? Maybe he was he had a long day at work today too. You know, let's give him some grace. You know, no, my husband's amazing, he's very helpful with my daughter, you know. So, you know, like I have to kind of talk myself through those as soon as I hear those inner critical thoughts starts to come up, because I have to catch myself making up that belief and then rewriting it in that moment so that I stop spiraling and looking for evidence to create that story.
SPEAKER_05Absolutely, absolutely. Kathy, you are helping somebody this morning. Yeah, I hope so. Um sure, because um, you know, again, the the the stories that we tell ourselves, again, we go searching for the evidence to, you know, to label our spouse as the enemy. And we were our spouse is our advocate, that's our partner. That's that's who we decided we were gonna spend the rest of our life with. And you know, for for when when we have that conversation with ourselves and we basically just vomit on them, yeah, you know, they're they're like you know, for most, most husbands, I'll say this, they don't always come in with, okay, my wife is going through a rough moment. No, you know, no, they automatically say that's disrespect. She doesn't like me anymore. I don't know why she married me in the first place. If all because now they're in their head with all of the stuff. Right. So if we can regulate ourselves before, you know, we step into that space, we can we can avoid, I believe, 90% of the arguments and fights that we have. 100%. Again, we we already have the fight up here. Yes. We're just taking it out of our heads now and making it real right here. But one of the one of the um one of the questions that I I encourage couples to always ask each other, uh, well, ask themselves before they step into that hard conversation or that fight is is what I believe right now, whatever is happening in my head, is that based or grounded in truth? What is my evidence? What is the truth surrounding my husband doesn't help? Okay, let's really examine that. Does he truly not help or does he not help the way you want?
SPEAKER_04You know, yes.
SPEAKER_05I we and I, you know, we've been in in the different um, we've been in some of these similar circles where we had the conversation about how, you know, make being intentional about choosing joy or choosing gratitude, you know, and so that gratitude, if we decide to go the gratitude route, we eliminate a lot of convers a lot of heart um.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, 100%. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05There's still there's still be disagreements, but how do we um how do we handle it? How do we interrupt those patterns? You know, you know, growing up again, we we tap into the what is it, the family of origin, and we take the you know, that's it into our man and yeah, you know, blow it all up. But they the the um the flex there that I heard you say was growing your emotional intelligence. And listen, wives, that's work that we have to be intentional about. We have to decide that we're gonna grow our emotional intelligence by meditation or praying or getting tips or however you feed your soul, we have to decide that we're gonna do um do that work.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. You know, I I tell my clients like all the time, and just people I have conversations with, is um, I truly believe that our relationship is not about the other person, they are just reflection of our inner world. Like that's the relationships are there to teach us something about ourselves, you know. So, so when we see ourselves like kind of like judging our partner and whatnot, you know, it's really is a part of us that's frustrated that we're not growing fast enough. Yeah. Right. Yeah. And so, and and so and and I think, and I think honestly, it gets can it can be kind of tricky, right? Especially for somebody like like me in the coaching world where I'm always I'm I'm 110% into personal development, right? And there were seasons where I would find myself like that, my husband, because my husband is not in this world, you know, he's a very like corporate guy, structured, been corporate all his life. Um, he has, you know, he has some emotional intelligence, but he's not into the personal development space as heavily as I am. And I remember part, like, you know, at a certain part in my personal development journey, I find myself like resenting that he isn't growing as fast as I am.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04But looking back now, it's because I haven't grown enough. I haven't healed enough. So I'm judging my my progress and and basically it's like projecting it onto him. Right. And so now I realize that anything that like I am frustrated of about my husband specifically, it's really is some part of me that I haven't made peace with, I haven't healed, that I have, yeah, and it's just that relationship is just basically a reflection of the things I need to work on. So when I look at it through that lens, it really shifts that perspective for me. Yeah. You know, so it's it's not it's so it's no longer about him versus me. And so I like what you said about the emotional intelligence, that's the work for us. And I absolutely agree because you know, when I find myself in that space, it's like I have to turn back inward to myself and be like, okay, like what part of me is having an issue with this? Right. And what is he showing me? So, like, yeah, it's like if I'm kind of like fussy about him not growing or like, you know, being more into person development or whatever, then that means that there's a part of me that's frustrated in my own growth.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_04That's it. You know, and that's something I gotta work on, you know, and I can't go at him and be like, why are you not growing more? You know, I because I can't change him, right? Right. And it's just it, it just is just a reflection of our in the world. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. And this that's such a good uh good point. Um because we are we're expert at using the microscope to examine other people versus using the mirror to look at ourselves.
SPEAKER_04Oh yes, yes, yes, that is.
SPEAKER_05I want to look at myself. It's easier because it's easier to point point out other people's stuff. And you know, there's a um, you know, just to part of what you just said, I I also feel that when whatever is going on in us, when you know, when that anger shows up or whatever emotion is invoked based on your interaction with someone, it's the hurt and the pain in us that it's still attaching to. So when you talk about, you know, we just haven't healed enough, that is so spot on because that's how we learn, that's how we grow. So if you're in your marriage at in this season and you feel like, oh my God, I must have married the wrong person, you know, unless there are physical abuse, and I always have to say that, unless there's physical abuse happening, you're being hurt on a regular basis. And I mean, I wouldn't even say regular basis. If you've been hurt once, it's time for you to separate. Walk away because you are being, you know, you're being physically abused. That's a whole nother conversation. So I never want people to think that I am, you know, endorsing unhealthy relationships. That's not what I'm talking about. But I you think that you need to get a divorce because we are constantly fighting. We're constantly disagreeing. You know, stop for a second and start examining what's in me, what is not growing, what area does um, what area keeps, you know, uh, I don't know, to clicking on that remote. Why is that button still keep getting pushed? You know what I mean? And so I I always um you know encourage people to, you know, to take a look at um at themselves, you know, do the inner work, you know, call Kathy, do the inner work. Yes, call me.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah. And you know, and and I I and I I love what you said about because people divorce because they're like, did I marry the wrong person? You know, and yeah, and and I've I feel that because there was a point of time when I was just like thinking, oh my gosh, like my husband's not growing, he's just stagnant, he's complacent, like, you know, he's not whatever, whatever. Um, am I did I marry the wrong person? You know, and I start having all these questions. Um, but the more the the deeper I got into regulating, building my emotional intelligence, and it's just that it's not about him. It's always about me and my internal world, you know. It's always been about yeah, and and and the the crazy thing, I think and a lot of I feel like a lot of women or ambitious women who are growing, I think we have a tendency to want to change the other person. Yeah. We have a tendency to say, we can see their potential. Why are they not there yet? Why are they this and this and this, you know? And and I'll admit, I was there too. Like earlier on in my journey, I was there too. Like wondering, like, why is my husband not learning about, you know, whatever, how his about his emotions and not learning about this and this, you know? But then what I realized is the more I was like grilling on him about it, the more disconnected he became on the topic. Yes. Right. So it's almost like now I really lead with, you know what? Like the better I can be, the better version that I can be for myself, the more it will inspire him to do the same. Like I don't need to drag him across the finish line. It's like he can see it, and it's evident in the way I show up in my marriage, it's evident in the way I move, and that will inspire change in him, you know, because he'll see what's possible. And when his time is right, like he'll change too. He'll come along too. Yeah, but it's not my job to like pull him, you know, by the lake and like drag him along with me. And I think that for me, and I think I feel like a lot of more women should understand that that it's not about you dragging the other person along with you. It's like you become the example first, yeah, and then he will follow.
SPEAKER_05You know? Absolutely. Because once you once you once we work on ourselves, we show up different. Exactly. Exactly. You know, exactly. When we love people well, you they are encouraged to love us back well.
SPEAKER_03Exactly.
SPEAKER_05I look at everything as a seed, you know. Um, you know that I'm I'm a believer. So, you know, in Genesis it talks about um Jesus, I mean, um, God says, as long as the earth remained, it will always be seed time and harvest. So I look at everything as sowing and then reaping a harvest from it. You know. If I l go into my marriage loving well, my husband's gonna love me well. You know, love me. If I impart into my kids well, you know, the hope is that they will come up and be, you know, good humans and better humans and also impact the world. Um one of the question I wanted to look at is um, do you think that we always recognize when our expectations are unrealistic, unspoken, you know, or rooted in past experiences? Because you mentioned um, you know, the expectation that you had of him. You know, you saw his potential. And, you know, it's almost like you saw the potential and you want to go to work to make the potential happen. Let's get in there and get this done. Frustrating the daylights out of him.
SPEAKER_04Oh yeah, yes.
SPEAKER_05You know, oh my gosh. Yeah. What what did that uh what did that look like? And you know, how did you get from that to make the shift?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, you know, I was doing exactly that actually. Why don't you do X, Y, and Z, you know, because uh yeah, you know, for me, yes, like those expectations were unrealistic, right? And because I truly believe that the spouse that we choose to marry and to spend the rest of our life with, it's not going to be our equal. It's like they're our they are our counterpart.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_04Like, like I feel like they they add something that we might be lacking. And I feel like we never truly choose somebody who is like thinking the same way as us or like operating in the same way as we do. And so and so I know that for me, um, you know, learning that it w was that that shift for me because um I realized that before I was trying to make him the same as me. And that expectation was just not realistic. Because, you know, he has a different set of skills, he has different he he grew up differently, different set of beliefs. Um, so there is no way that I am going to try to turn him into me. Right. And I wouldn't want to, right? Because then sometimes I think I'm like, do I really want to be married to myself?
SPEAKER_05Like um, yeah, so we yeah, we we have the the tendency to get in there and want to pull out potential and then you know go to work and try to make them into geez. And then like you said, they they they show up in your in the marriage with their own values, their own, their own um, you know, ideas, their own goals. You know, they they were created for for more than just being husbands as well, you know what I mean? And so I think that um, you know, the the the danger um in that that can really pull your you know our marriage apart is when we see them as not good enough as they are. But but yeah, we you know we we get into that space and we are you know get into our marriage and think that yeah they're they are our projects and you know we have to do do all of that. And I was like, no, they they are created um you know to to pursue their goals and dreams just like we were and you know when we convey the message that they're not good enough you know just being just themselves. It's you know imagine what that does, you know, what that that does for us.
SPEAKER_04Right.
SPEAKER_05Um so we yeah, oh my goodness, the time goes by so so quickly.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. But I really did.
SPEAKER_05I do want you to talk a little bit about your um your free telegram channel, your welcome recalibr uh recalibration codes. Yes. Because I know um, like we were saying earlier, um, you know, again talking to our audience that you know, yeah, you will create we are all created for so much more. And a lot of the women that I have on here, they are business owners, they are writers, they have so many other projects going on. And so for one, I'm always appreciative when you guys are able to take time out of your day. And there's a little one behind you.
SPEAKER_04Oh, hi, honey. Okay.
SPEAKER_05You're taking time out of your day to you know come in and um have these amazing conversations. So I'm always so, so grateful and um have so much gratitude for that. So, you know, talk a little bit about how, for one, how you juggle all of this, because hey, Kathy is an amazing makeup artist. And I I mean, I can't even makeup artists does not even define all of what she does. You know, she has that going on. And then um, so talk a little bit about you know, of course, the businesses that you do and the you know, of course, the ones that you really want these ladies to connect with you.
SPEAKER_04Uh yeah. Yeah. So with my makeup business, I started this about maybe over 10 years ago. We're at like 13 years now. Um, so it's been an established business here. Um, but in the process of growing my own business to a multi-six figure um brand, I realized that a lot of my growth was you through the inner work. So I felt like the more I grew internally, the more my business grew. You know, and and you there's a saying that entrepreneurship is like, you know, uh personal development on crack, right? Oh my god.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And uh, yeah, and I was like, yeah, a hundred percent, you know, and I yes, and over the course of, you know, the last decade, just being a business owner. So I started my business as a side hustle out of my bedroom. Um, and I was working full-time. And then I grew it, and then we ended up in a studio, and then we grew it to now a team of 10. And this side hustle has afforded me the ability to quit my corporate job in 2024 to really become a full-time business owner, which I'm forever, you know, grateful for. Um, but what I really felt called to do was not to only make women beautiful on the outside, right? To do makeup and make them look in the mirror and feel beautiful. But what I really felt called is having them feel confident and powerful and wealthy on the inside. Because I think that when money or in uh when money gets in the hands of more women, we can do so much good in the world, you know? And and I recognize that there are a lot of um patterns and beliefs that are keeping a lot of women, a lot of entrepreneurs at a certain income level. Okay. And a lot of the times we don't even know that those are patterns because it is just operating, right, at a subconscious level and it's become part of who we are. So part of my mission and part of my goal is to really help women recognize those patterns, right? Become more aware. Um, and so that's why I created the wealth recalibration codes, uh free telegram channel, because I want women to plug into it. I want women to understand, like, hey, you know, these are the energetic codes that can really shift your business. Because there comes to a point, and you know this too, right, Karen, there comes a point in your business where you feel like you've done all the things, like you've done all the strategies, you've done all the things that all the coaches, all the everybody, whatever the the internet is telling you to do. And every course. Yes. Same here, girl, same here. And you know, you've done everything, yeah, but you feel like you're still running up against a ceiling. Right. So this this Telegram channel is for those women where you they you know on some level of your being that the strategy isn't the issue anymore. Yeah. And now the issue is who you are when you execute those strategies, right? And that's what the um wealth recalibration codes are. It's about looking a little bit deeper. Like, who are you being when you move? Who are you being when you show up? Because it doesn't matter what you do, like two people can be doing the same things, but it one person will have exponential results and the other person might have very little to no results. And the difference is in the energetic, the wealth codes, like how they show up. Oh, you should have. You know, yeah, how you show up in your identity, in your certainty, right? And so, um, so really that's what the Telegram channel is about. It's like, hey, I want to interrupt the way that you've been thinking. I want to interrupt the process, right? And for you to actually look at your day-to-day and see where the leaks are. And when you can plug those leaks, you know, your one action that you normally take will 10x the results.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And so that's the mission, right? Just to help more women become more prosper um prosperous because that's the goal. You don't want to just because uh yeah, you know, there's nothing more beautiful, I think, is when a woman really like when she uh when she shows up in her full power and the outside, her beauty on the outside matches the power that's on the inside. And she's she becomes like unstoppable, you know? And and that's what I want.
SPEAKER_05Exactly, exactly. Because you know, the the the um yes, like you said, the makeup make us we we we look great, you know, because I'll tell you, I'm you know, sitting in uh your team member's chair, and I walk away looking like dang, okay. You got this, we got this. You look good and feel good. And uh the thing is if there is um uncertainty or fear on the inside, there's no amount of makeup that can cover that. You know, you so having that, you know, that foresight to see that, hey, I'm not just gonna, you know, create an amazing woman on the outside, but the work has to actually be on the inside so it can shine through. And then the makeup, yeah, that's just a plus. That's a plus cherry on top.
SPEAKER_04Yep, there you go. Yeah, exactly. I I love that's so well said, Karen. Yeah. It's just that cherry on top, right? Because how you feel on the inside is really gonna radiate. And yeah, there's nothing more that I love to see more than more women stepping into their power more unapologetically, you know. And even whether you're a mom or you know, a stay-at-home mom or a um, you know, an entrepreneur, half mom, whatever, you know, doc mom, cat moms, whatever, you're right. Like, like I just want you to show up and just really own that power. And yeah, and and it's it's so beautiful when we work on ourselves first, and it always starts with us.
SPEAKER_05It always starts with us. One last question before you go, Kathy. And I ask all my guests this question what is one thing you wish you knew before you got married?
SPEAKER_04Oh, that's a good one. You know, I I wish I knew the amount of pride that you would have to shed at the door, like when you enter a relationship. And the amount of, you know, the amount of like willingness to change. Like, you know, because I think that, you know, I when I came into the relationship, I was very like, this is who like, you know, like I was just very like rigid, but also I think that in a marriage and relationship, it's it's a give and take, you know, it's that negotiation. And I what I wish I had the what I wish I had more of entering into the relationship is a better set of communication skills, like knowing how to communicate better.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um, because for me, like my husband is a great communicator, and I've learned so much from him through the past, you know, like we've been together for like 15 years. Over the past like decade plus, I've learned to verbalize and communicate a lot better. Um, but when I started in the relationship, I I didn't know how to communicate well. And I think that that um caused a lot of unnecessary like fights and issues that we didn't even have to experience had I learned how to better communicate.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah. And and I agree. I agree with that. Um men communicate their needs very easily. They they sure do. They have no Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, and I feel like women, a lot of us will uh will uh like I don't know about you specifically, Karen, but I know that my I grew up in a household where my mom was super passive aggressive, like that was her communication style. Yeah, and so when I started in the relationship, I had those tendencies to be very passive aggressive, right? Because that's the only way I knew how. And my husband didn't respond well to that because he's one of those people that needs it straight, needs it direct, you know, like don't assume anything else kind of deal. And so that was a really like big lesson for me. So yeah, so for the women that you know are about to get married, you know, that that might be a big tip for them.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, absolutely. That that passive my husband is the is the same way. Um, passive aggressiveness does not go over well with him because he's gonna ask the follow-up question, like, oh, so what are you saying, what you're saying is, and then I don't have I I don't know what to say after that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, it those it's been 34 years, but I'm telling you, those four um first three or four years was was pretty rough when it came to the communication style and how we deal dealt with conflict. He he pretty much knew how to navigate it because he knew exactly what he wanted, what he expected from our marriage. I I didn't know. I I didn't know, Kathy. I just yeah.
SPEAKER_04And it's okay, right? And it's okay.
SPEAKER_05And we and we would learn a lot. It did.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_05And that's again, this is why we're creating space for these type of conversations, because we know that there's so much joy on the other side of that. And so with that, we'll we'll end here. We'll wrap our session here. This is so good. I am so again, so grateful for you taking the time to continue and chat with us.
SPEAKER_04Oh, thank you. It's such it's been such an honor and privilege to be on your podcast. Um, you know, and thank you for making space and just really opening up the conversation for more women. Because honestly, like what you're doing, Karen, um, it's really is life-changing and it's gonna save a lot of marriages. Because I wish I had something like this when I was getting married, you know? Because so, you know, because the only option that we had when I like got married was like you gotta go to like marriage counseling, like therapy. Like you gotta sit down, and sometimes that doesn't work if our partner isn't like the willing participant, you know? Yeah, so I love that there are these open conversations where the wives can plug in and learn and have a different perspective um on her own time away from the husband. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05Absolutely. So thank you. Absolutely. And uh yeah, so that brings me to um, you know, of course, tune in for another episode. We are gonna have a you know similar conversation, of course, with a you know, uh different guest. But again, Kathy, thank you so very much for you know come talking with us. Um, all Kathy's information will be in the show notes. So if you want to follow her on Instagram, check out her um her uh channel, um, telegram channel and learn all about wealth recali say the word calibration recalibration.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I know it's it's a mouthful.
SPEAKER_05All right, ladies, have a wonderful day. Thank you so much once again for joining us on another episode of the State of Our Union and the fight to keep it.